Matt ties himself in knots. Genres, eh? Way of categorising records in shops, or basis for your identity?

Matt is thrown by Paul Meme’s almost pathological enthusiasm for stuff, which means that “music Paul likes” = industrial.

However Matt has already invested quite a lot in NOT liking industrial music. Being good chaps, there is obviously some cross-over. Hence confusion.

It seems clear to me that Cabaret Voltaire and Neubauten are industrial. The cabs released stuff on Industrial Records (possibly just cassettes?), supported TG at gigs and were interviewed in the seminal “Industrial Culture Handbook” by RE/SEARCH.

Neubauten fit squarely into the mid-80s Some Bizzare scene which also included PTV and Coil (and the Cabs/Foetus/Test Dept/SWANS – etc mmmmmmmmm!).

23 Skidoo included David Tibet in their early ritualistic incarnation and one of their members lived next door to the P-Orridges in Hackney. Plus they played the heavily industrial “Final Academy” Burroughs-fest.

I suppose there is room for a number of sub-categories (including the whole new-beat spin-off).

Paul is just as guilty, however, for refusing to accept the gothic elements of Killing Joke, Joy Division and Coil.